MCEBuddy

Ok - I have read as many posts as possible to try and conquer this - but still running into issues.  For the record - I love MCE Buddy, its silent, effective, FAST, and sits quietly on a nice MCE box.

 I have a ZUNE Upgraded and running 2.3 now.  I have used a few other 3rd party apps and found a few places where the ZUNE SYNCH (Transcode) is not needed if the file is transcoded perfect the first time.

 I have also tested and understand kinda (the mencode engine) challenges that perhaps the ZUNE is looking for which MCE Buddy does not have.  I agree and is likely why these other apps seem to work.

 Then I read a post about using the PSP W profile - but I simply can't see that one working - the ZUNE SW on my end in typcial fashion FORCES the 2nd transcode in the synch.  If it copied as quickly as said I believe its because it had already gone thru the 2nd transcode.

 My friends ----- just like most of us with a ZUNE, what if anything is my best bet to AVOID 2 TRANSCODES.  Synch = Copy from an MCE Buddy processed file.

 I am willing to BETA PARTICIPATE in anything and fine to get my hands very dirty.  I don't want to fart with another app - MCE Buddy is it for me and hoping I can nail this.  I also have never seen an .MP4 ever transcoded that could just land on my ZUNE - maybe I am missing that one?  The iPOD Gen5 still wants the double transcode.

 Thanks so much for any assistance????

Chris

ckolibab:

Ok - I have read as many posts as possible to try and conquer this - but still running into issues.  For the record - I love MCE Buddy, its silent, effective, FAST, and sits quietly on a nice MCE box.

 I have a ZUNE Upgraded and running 2.3 now.  I have used a few other 3rd party apps and found a few places where the ZUNE SYNCH (Transcode) is not needed if the file is transcoded perfect the first time.

 I have also tested and understand kinda (the mencode engine) challenges that perhaps the ZUNE is looking for which MCE Buddy does not have.  I agree and is likely why these other apps seem to work.

 Then I read a post about using the PSP W profile - but I simply can't see that one working - the ZUNE SW on my end in typcial fashion FORCES the 2nd transcode in the synch.  If it copied as quickly as said I believe its because it had already gone thru the 2nd transcode.

 My friends ----- just like most of us with a ZUNE, what if anything is my best bet to AVOID 2 TRANSCODES.  Synch = Copy from an MCE Buddy processed file.

 I am willing to BETA PARTICIPATE in anything and fine to get my hands very dirty.  I don't want to fart with another app - MCE Buddy is it for me and hoping I can nail this.  I also have never seen an .MP4 ever transcoded that could just land on my ZUNE - maybe I am missing that one?  The iPOD Gen5 still wants the double transcode.

 Thanks so much for any assistance????

Chris

 

To avoid two transcodes I need to know exactly what I can transcode to.  The documentation seems to imply divx/wmv/h.264 but that might not be native, it might just be supported for transcoding.  If the Zune needs WMV9 natively as the only non-transcoded format then we're in a fair wait as mencoder does not produce WMV9 and will not in the near future,  

There's a new MCEBuddy encode update coming so I've added you to the beta program.  In it will be a new Zune profile.

Cheers

Derek 

Derek -

 As I recall when the Zune first came out "and unless the embedded codecs have changed" you hit it on the head - the Software would support the other formats but the native code on the device is WMV.  On a previous thread I saw your comments of a new profile syntax and added some of that - as well as looking into the files I did create with some 3rd party apps to drop on it, and have not had much luck with MCE Buddy.

 I appreciate the support and will help all I can.

 Thanks sir

Chris

Derek -

 I sent you a PM with some further details - and have been side by side trying to digest this issue and adjust profiles - still no luck.  Oddly I think it "may" be the audio.  Take a look at my PM as I think the VIDEO is WMV1 which I am getting in the other app but the audio is WMV7 which I also think was before WM9? 

 What I know for certain is I can take a small or large DVR-MS file - transcode with this app - and drop directly to the ZUNE with the ZUNE SW not needing another transcode. 

 The hope and the prayer is that we are still within range of having MCE BUDDY mirror that profile and I am "slightly" optomistic...... 

I also know this.  When I look at the FILE/DETAILS from the other app I see a few more of the params loaded but the BUDDY details won't show.  They may be there - but for some reason they are not loading into the details of the file (SO) (MAYBE) the file matches - but the ZUNE app is not reading those attributes hence shaping the file the way it likes it.

 DETAILS I see blank or null with BUDDY are

- DATA RATE

- FPS

Again - more fyi than anything else Derek.

 Thanks

 

Let me add a few things to clarify what I did.  I recorded about 15 seconds of TV, renamed it to start with 1 so MCEbuddy transcoded first, and then started going down the line for export options.  The WMV ones I tried didn't work but I promise you that PSP W worked for me without retranscoding.  After letting the buddy run all night I sync'd up 6 movies and 15 tv shows in about 10 minutes on my Zune. 

 My specs:

• Zune 80, 2.3 firmware
• Zune software, x86 2.1 version
• Windows Vista Ulitmate, 32-bit
• MCEBuddy 1.0.7
• FFDShow tryouts 1685

I believe MP4 is a native format because that's what's sitting on my zune now.  Also all the Ipod Video podcasts I subscribe to use MP4.  I've included screenshots from a movie I left MCEbuddy transcode using PSP W.  I then sync up in 1 minute without transcoding.  If this doesn't work, again, I think its due to the Zune's very finnicky software.  Sometimes my library wouldn't update with my new videos for a minute or so.  It helps to right click on the video file and say 'play with zune' to get into your collection.

 

 

Great response - and read this post you made before (only wish it was true for me)....

 I have skinned my environment down to a very baby-step setup to watch the process closely, hence I tried exactly what you mentioned.  Now I do have a converted Zune V1 to 2.3 but am not aware of a hardware spec change.  I may in fact be getting an 80 and will compare them side by side, but for now mine indeed is running 2.3 as well.

I have ZERO issues getting these files - or most files at all in the Library.  I am actually just moving them there manually then making sure the TRANSCODE process does not occur without me seeing it with the ZUNE software.  I WILL ADD THIS......  I have noticed that "sometimes" - when the ZUNE SW is retranscoding an MP4 it can step thru it very fast.  Almost as if it is processing just a header change.  So it is possible for the ZUNE SW to retranscode a small file - quick, heck even a large one in less than a few minutes.  I have absolutely seen this.  With WMV - not usually the case.

 I promise to try your suggestion again - I have done this now on 2 machines with pretty much identical setups to yours.

I thank you again.  Watch for the fast transcode from the ZUNE SW.  Take the file away from your sune - then add it manually.  "Watch" if the first step to the SYNCH process is "CONVERSION" / "SYNCH" ...  that will occur then the copy occurs.  If the file is 100% clean for the ZUNE and you indeed watch it thru - the CONVERSION never will occur.... 

Heck - when I first got my ZUNE, I had apps much like with iPod that allowed drag and drop even though the SW would not agree, but the device would in fact play it.  I much prefer that but have not dug enough for apps to allow that as of recent.....

Thanks - let me know, I will try     

Chris

Triple check verified on my side the file does indeed go thru the CONVERSION step directly before synch.  Relatively fast - but it does occur.  Again - there "may" perhaps be a HW CODEC for .MP4 on the Zune80 not on the Zune1 flavors but can't tell you that currently.  I am considering grabbing one.

 Funny thing is I was a first adopter of the Zune - all this stuff tick'd me off so my Zune landed in the drawer for a year or so.  Here I am thinking about getting another one :)  classic....

I think Buddy for me is just a few params from a direct WMV file but not sure.  Derek - all - let me know and sure do appreciate the support.

Chris

High-leve support for all zunes is found here: http://www.zune.net/en-us/support/usersguide/musicvideospictures/avcodecsandformats.htm 

 

Zune specs for each device, in detail, can be found on the product information pages at zune.net.

Zune 80/8/4 (http://www.zune.net/en-us/products/zune80gb/specs.htm):

VIDEO SUPPORT

Windows Media Video (WMV) (.wmv) – Main and Simple Profile, CBR or VBR, up to 3.0 Mbps peak video bit rate; 720 pixels x 480 pixels up to 30 frames per second (or 720 pixels x 576 pixels up to 25 frames per second). Zune software will transcode HD WMV files at device sync

MPEG-4 (MP4/M4V) (.mp4) Part 2 video[4] – Simple Profile up to 2.5 Mbps peak video bit rate; 720 pixels x 480 pixels up to 30 frames per second (or 720 pixels x 576 pixels up to 25 frames per second).  Zune software will transcode HD MPEG-4 files at device sync

H.264 video[4] – Baseline Profile up to 2.5 Mbps peak video bit rate; 720 pixels x 480 pixels up to 30 frames per second (or 720 pixels x 576 pixels up to 25 frames per second). Zune software will transcode HD H.264 files at device sync

DVR-MS[5] – Zune software will transcode at time of sync

Zune 30 (http://www.zune.net/en-us/products/zune30gb/specs.htm)

VIDEO SUPPORT

Windows Media Video (WMV) (.wmv) – Main and Simple Profile, CBR or VBR, up to 800,000 bps average video bit rate and 1,500,000 bps peak video bit rate; 320 pixels x 240 pixels (4:3 QVGA) or 320 pixels x 180 pixels (16:9 QVGA) up to 30 frames per second. Zune software will transcode VGA HD WMV files at device sync

MPEG-4 (MP4/M4V) (.mp4) Part 2 video[4] – Zune software will transcode MPEG-4 files at device sync

H.264 video[5] –Zune software will transcode H.264 files at device sync

DVR-MS – Zune software will transcode at time of sync

 

ckolibab:

I have noticed that "sometimes" - when the ZUNE SW is retranscoding an MP4 it can step thru it very fast.  Almost as if it is processing just a header change.  So it is possible for the ZUNE SW to retranscode a small file - quick, heck even a large one in less than a few minutes.  I have absolutely seen this.

I thank you again.  Watch for the fast transcode from the ZUNE SW.  Take the file away from your sune - then add it manually.  "Watch" if the first step to the SYNCH process is "CONVERSION" / "SYNCH" ...  that will occur then the copy occurs.  If the file is 100% clean for the ZUNE and you indeed watch it thru - the CONVERSION never will occur.... 

 

I think I saw this too.  Sometimes the Zune software says under the Device/Status that it's "converting" but its really just syncing up (i.e., copying directly).  The software is just weird like that.  I recommend having the task manager open and sort processes by name.  If you see a "ZuneEnc.exe" pop up than its really transcoding.  I've also heard of some people raising the priority of this process to recode faster.

pnear:

VIDEO SUPPORT

Windows Media Video (WMV) (.wmv) – Main and Simple Profile, CBR or VBR, up to 800,000 bps average video bit rate and 1,500,000 bps peak video bit rate; 320 pixels x 240 pixels (4:3 QVGA) or 320 pixels x 180 pixels (16:9 QVGA) up to 30 frames per second. Zune software will transcode VGA HD WMV files at device sync

MPEG-4 (MP4/M4V) (.mp4) Part 2 video[4] – Zune software will transcode MPEG-4 files at device sync

H.264 video[5] –Zune software will transcode H.264 files at device sync

DVR-MS – Zune software will transcode at time of sync

Ahh.  Some information I can sink my teeth into.  Basically, if its not WMV then you get a transcode.  That's not god news for reasons described before.  What we're not told is what versions of WMV are not transcoded.  Looking at this specification on face value, the WMV 320 wide profile in MCEBuddy should work, as should the current "Zune" profile (also WMV I think).  So the way forward is:

• Check to see if the Zune or WMV 320 profile output files are transcoded when transferred to the zune
• If they are not, try to work out what causes them to fail on the Zune

There are not a lot of options to play with in WMV as the open source video and transcoding libraries do not have good WMV support for obvious reasons but we can give it a shot.  As for WMV testing assuming no transcode occurs, we can check the file plays back correctly under Windows first.  Other than that I'll be relying on yourselves to get information from the Zune forums and community to find out what we need to do to get WMV2 working on the Zune.

Cheers

Derek

 

I read that differently than you do.  For The v2 Zunes, it will not transcode MP4 or h.264 up to a resolution of 720x480.  Anything over that resolution gets transcoded (ie HD MP4 or HD h.264).

The Zune 30 looks to be WMV only though.

Pete

 

pnear:

I read that differently than you do.  For The v2 Zunes, it will not transcode MP4 or h.264 up to a resolution of 720x480.  Anything over that resolution gets transcoded (ie HD MP4 or HD h.264).

The Zune 30 looks to be WMV only though.

Pete

 

That should mean that Zune2 shouldn't transcode anything produced by the iPod profile.  Can anyone test this?

Derek 

 I'll try tonight some profiles and document my results.  I have a zune 80.  I will mention that last night I was playing around with a trial version of a commercial zune converter and noticed it used WMV encoders 7, 8, 9.  The zune software is very buggy though.  At first when I tried to synch only 2 of 9 WMV sync'd correctly, 7 error messages got generated.  But then I restarted the software and the files all sync'd. 

The above post was correct and I head suspected from some other reading that the MP4 codec was added apparently in HW not in SW/Firmware to the ZUNE2/80.

 Like an idiot I went and bought one ;)  The PSP/W does indeed work without transcoding - and am moving data to it now.

Derek - I sent you several PM's on my Testing with the ZUNE30 and some of the WMV testing that may help you there.

 For now I am going to look at what I can get on the ZUNE/80 without the double transcoding, but that transcodes FAST with the acceptable quality.

 Derek - any chance of adding a timing trigger for running of the app.  Currently I have been using LifeExtender to parse out my commercials and should give MCE Buddy a chance at that.  However would not mind having MCE Buddy run at intervals that are triggered?

One thing I can say - this app is a ROCK.  I have had it working on about 300 recordings of all sizes - ZERO ISSUES - or hangs.  My only suck is my HBO's are DRM'd so they result in bogus files :(  Not sure we can fix that.

I am testing with the 80 now to see what I can get on it with just the Buddy Encode.  I CAN ALSO CONFIRM THIS SAME PROFILE PSP/W will also drop to an iPhone with NO second trancode needed.

For, keep in mind my specs: Zune 80, Windows Ultimate 32, ATSC Dvrms

I tried both Ipod profiles (5 & 6) and can confirm that they both re-transcode prior to syncing.  Both PSP profiles work.  Looking at the mencoder config, there must be some minute differences that the Zune doesn't play natively.

None of the other mpeg4 profiles worked, especially as most of them export as avi.  Also, none of the WMV files played in my zune 80 natively, probably because the old wmv2 encoder was used.